Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Edek

March Errata

Recommended Posts

Any ideas? 
I'd like a rework to vSpigot where he's no longer Spigot ;) To be serious, INF 2/3 on Stave is all I'd like to see, or INF 4/6 on Tapper, so a Tapper and Stave team has a base 12INF 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I mean, I'd like to see them give Esters some variation of "Empowered Voice" back and put "Tooled Up" back on oSpigs, but I seriously doubt that will be an option..

vDecimate needs to be tac 6 or have her playbook reworked to only be four long, but other than that I feel the guild is in a decent (if not prominent) place..

For novelty / thematic value I'd still like to see Hooper become a 1/8" kick and both pets get a Heroic, but I doubt it's that sort of errata...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think we'll see a significant buff to rat catchers and a slight nerf to navs. As it stands I think the teams are pretty well balanced.

Edit:

Actually looking at the longshanks statistics I think morts and hunters will get a nerf of some sort. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A standard brewers playbook with anatomical is just broken. Decimate is really good as she is. Against a 4+/1 model (the most common def stats) she's basically a TAC7 model, just like Hooper. 

Tooled Up on Spigot would simply be a nerf to Spigot :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Edek said:

Against a 4+/1 model (the most common def stats) she's basically a TAC7 model, just like Hooper. 

Nope, she's still tac 5 with a 5 long playbook.. zero chance of wrapping and unlikely to get more than 2-3 successes without assistance..

*edit*
not saying she's "bad" so to speak, just overly nerfed due to Gu.B.S getting pissy..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Redmaw said:

Nope, she's still tac 5 with a 5 long playbook.. zero chance of wrapping and unlikely to get more than 2-3 successes without assistance..

Tapper, Hooper and Spigot are the only Brewers that can wrap on their own, and still their chance to wrap is very slim without any assists. She brings the best enemy reposition in the guild, she's the model with the best Threat Range, is the best against high ARM models and can fill any roll you need. Decimate doesn't need a single change to her and I'd say people just got too used to her in S3 and don't see how much potential she still has. God I hope they don't buff her, it'll just make people play the same six every game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stave feels too weak to me. 2/3 INF would look fine to me.

I do not see a place for Stoker and would appreciate a change for him. No idea what could be done, though. Reduction character trait (like Burnish)? Would fit thematically, but would it be good enough? 

Other than that, I don't think anything should be changed for Brewers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm no expert in Brewers, but I'm not getting the results I'd like from vDecimate, Stoker, or Stave. 
As a result, I'm doing exactly what the dev's said they didn't want.... consistently choosing other models due to performance, rather than taste. It's very similar to Angel on the Fish. It's not that there's anything wrong with her, she just doesn't do anything that someone else in the guild doesn't do better. 

I agree that vDecimate is the best at re-positioning models, particularly with her heroic, but Tapper, Scum, Quaff, and Friday all have the option and also bring other things to the team. I'd like to see some of her higher results, like T, 3 dmg, or KD, be even just a little more reliable. 
I love the model and I really want to use her, but when I have she just doesn't add as much as I hope. 

Stave is a bit more useful with Esters, where his Lob Barrel is free, so his INF isn't quite as important, but he is stuck next to her and a bit of a one-trick pony at that point. His KD is nice and reliable, and Battering Ram is fun, but he could use either a second INF or to revers the order of his T and 3 Dmg results, IMO.

Stoker is an odd one. He's tough, doesn't have to worry about conditions (depending on when he's activated) and brings fire and it's associated movement penalty to the Brewers, but I'm just not sure how to fit him in. 

So, all of this is opinion, and essentially asking for advice if they don't make changes. 
Are other people seeing the same things, or am I using them wrongly?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think stave is one of those pieces that is amazing into a few teams. I'm not 100% sure it would be good for the game if he were and auto include in every matchup, and I believe he would be at 2-3. Also with him getting a free heroic off of esters he doesn't usually need any influence anyway.

I couldn't see tapper going up to 4-6 again. Old Jakes is a very good ability and I think having 2 influence extra for a tapper team would be too good. 

Stoker maybe needs a bit more speed. A good way of adding it without bending him into a striker would be to give him the +1/+2 speed and -2 kick with the heroic. Make sense as he's setting himself on fire anyway. He's a good pick if he has a little more reach in my opinion. He could get to insane places with quick foot and times called.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, mbdeyes said:

Stoker is an odd one. He's tough, doesn't have to worry about conditions (depending on when he's activated) and brings fire and it's associated movement penalty to the Brewers, but I'm just not sure how to fit him in. 

Ironically I think Stoker is fantastic into Rats, he also does a surprising amount of damage and can catch opponents off guard if they aren't used to seeing him..

vDecimate needs to be tac 6 or move her GB/KD down a column...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, greysquigg said:

I think stave is one of those pieces that is amazing into a few teams. I'm not 100% sure it would be good for the game if he were and auto include in every matchup, and I believe he would be at 2-3. Also with him getting a free heroic off of esters he doesn't usually need any influence anyway.

That's the problem with him and his heroic. With Esters he seems ok, with Tapper he feels like he's holding the team back with his influence.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, greysquigg said:

I couldn't see tapper going up to 4-6 again. Old Jakes is a very good ability and I think having 2 influence extra for a tapper team would be too good.

Let's compare it to Blessing of the Sun Father, for example. It's not limited to a captain, creates up to 3 inf of value which can exceed your cap (so you can put it even on fully loaded models). Comes with a drawback of CPs only, but the guild has a lot of ways to utilize it.

So I think Old Jake's doesn't necessarily fall into the category of 'too good' even with a 4/6 inf Tapper.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It seems like Stoker should be good into Navigators, right? With their rerolls almost always hitting, Armor 2 seems huge and slowing models down with Burning seems like it would throw off the plans for goal runs. 

I could be completely wrong though. I’m still waiting for my Esters box to show up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Decimate with Esters is one of the strongest (if not the strongest) kick off threats in the game. I certainly don't think she needs a buff and it would be detrimental to all the other brewer squaddies if she were better at everything (like the old days). 

I too would like to see Tapper or Stave get more inf. The kick off team for a new player is now at an atrocious 11 inf xD

Personally think Stokers molotov and flame jet could just become fire blast for simplicity, though they will probably not change that because of all the new token sets made. I think he is fine, if perhaps a little niche, but it would be cool if he got something that made him stand out a bit more - like heroic giving mercurys aura, or reduction like burnish, or random light support play. 

Put realistically in the bigger perspective I don't see brewers adjusted at all, other than perhaps something to Stave. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some change to make Tapper/Stave team have 12INF would be great. I would also like to see Stave with TAC5, 4 columns and move his MOM3 to the 4th column. To leave him an option to dish out some sweet dmg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yah, for Stave to be truly interesting he shouldn't be all about a barrel, but also have some sort of utility in his playbook (since his stats are not that fun to shove into a fight to begin with)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With a proper beating playbook he would be awesome, Barrel Lob to KD with his Heroic and 2-3 Attacks later. Commanding Aura to that and suddenly Stave is looking really good ;)@Steamforged you guys seeing this? :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Warpstoned said:

Decimate with Esters is one of the strongest (if not the strongest) kick off threats in the game. 

She isn't..

17 hours ago, Warpstoned said:

I certainly don't think she needs a buff

She does..

17 hours ago, Warpstoned said:

it would be detrimental to all the other brewer squaddies if she were better at everything

While making her "better at everything" would certainly be detrimental, making her good for more than a consistent 2" push.. With the results you want on her third column and only being Tac 5, it's a 50/50 coinflip on whether you will hit it on the "common" 4/1 defence.. once you get into the 5/0 or higher armour territory there was s a good chance you will just be wasting influence which would be better spent on someone else..

Again, I'm not saying she is a "bad" squaddie or doesn't have a use on the table, but she got nerfed too hard because people whinged that Brewers got the "best" Exile.. Looking at her now compared to the other Exile and Veteran squaddies from her release window, I'd be surprised if she got into the top five..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/30/2019 at 2:53 PM, Sid said:

Let's compare it to Blessing of the Sun Father, for example. It's not limited to a captain, creates up to 3 inf of value which can exceed your cap (so you can put it even on fully loaded models). Comes with a drawback of CPs only, but the guild has a lot of ways to utilize it.

So I think Old Jake's doesn't necessarily fall into the category of 'too good' even with a 4/6 inf Tapper.   

I'm not sure you can compare two heroics from different teams and expect them to have the same net benefit. In a brewers lineup, giving out free inf for attacks is better than free inf for character plays. So I think your logic is flawed in the sense that brewers will do a lot more with attacks than a hunters player will do with a free character play. In a tapper lineup that 2 inf could equate to 4 momentum and a load of damage with commanding aura and crowdouts. Which isn't an unreasonable assumption to make considering their team's theme is that they have mostly +1 tac on their playbook and need lot of setup before a few value activations. 

Tapper was dominating the brewers lineup before and now he's got a few great match-ups and a couple of bad ones which to me says he's pretty good as he is. I think something on the brewers lineup needs a buff, but I don't think it's tapper. 

Someone like Stoker or vDecimate needs a little tweaking to bring tapper's game back up again. As you certainly don't see stoker much, and you see vDecimate less, they should be the ones getting the buff. If a captain gets a buff I think it's only dealing with half of the problem. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, greysquigg said:

Tapper was dominating the brewers lineup before and now he's got a few great match-ups and a couple of bad ones which to me says he's pretty good as he is. I think something on the brewers lineup needs a buff, but I don't think it's tapper. 

Before is before Esters? ;) 

 

33 minutes ago, greysquigg said:

Someone like Stoker or vDecimate needs a little tweaking to bring tapper's game back up again. As you certainly don't see stoker much, and you see vDecimate less, they should be the ones getting the buff. If a captain gets a buff I think it's only dealing with half of the problem.

Decimate is still really good with Tapper, she's just better the more ARM the opposing team has. I really Decimate doesn't get buffed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes "before" is indeed before esters! She's good.

Might just be my meta but I don't see much vDecimate. Nor have I found she's been that amazing when I play. It's mostly hooper, spigot, friday and one of the big boys in a tapper line. IMO she needs a little something, definitely not to the heights she was in season 3 though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Warpstoned said:

Let's just leave it at we disagree on this matter. 

🙂

I apologize. I'm not trying to start something (other than a discussion).
However, I really feel like there's a big piece of my Brewers theory missing. I get a lot of statements like, "Decimate with Esters is one of the strongest (if not the strongest) kick off threats in the game."

However, I struggle with both Decimate and Esters.
I assume you mean she's good at getting the ball back from the other team once you've kicked off. Her 9" move (+2 or +4 with Quick Foot and Time's Called), the T/> on three, and the two inch melee certainly make her a threat at 11 to 13", which is enough to get well into the opponent's half of the table. I would think that would leave her really exposed to most teams, and her team mates would struggle to support her, especially if Spigot and Esters had to have already activated to set her up.
Do you bother to take her if you're receiving, though? She doesn't seem like the best goal threat. Do you pass the ball off to Esters to kill it with Resilience, or to Friday for later threat?

Going strictly by the numbers, Friday threatens the goal from 20" on her own, 22" with Esters, and 24" adding in Spigot's 'Time's Called'. She also has a dodge result so can even increase that potentially, but the initial 24" is without gamble. You don't have to hope she hits that dodge, push, or whatever. 
vSpigot has a 19" goal threat on his own, 21" with Esters's Quick Foot.
vDecimate has a 15" on her own, 17" with Quick Foot, and another couple if positioned well with her Heroic. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×