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mbdeyes

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I've tested out the team and so far just using Thresher, I am liking them. When kicking off, I set up a double alpha strike situation using Millstone pushes on Tater and Thresher after he kicks off. Then legendary with VHonour on Tater moving him up even more. Between the one-two punch of Thresher/Tater most teams lost a model or have two very low health targets at that point, then setting up for me to go first the following turn. Turn two I finish off models or if the ball is near will take out and score if viable. By this point my team is on their side of the pitch tearing into their team, my support keeps sprinting forward to reset counter charges, take conditions, or apply cocksure where needed. If they go for a goal, I throw it back into Peck, and push the ball back up field to my other players, holding till I want to score. The big threat range of the two lead hitters with Tater and Thresher is insane. Even when they take either out, they are both so fast, they are back into the action pretty quick and ripping the opposing team again. Butchers or Union ran VRage could be an issue if the player can see the turn one hits coming, if not you can get onto either captain and drop them at the start of turn two and they fold fast. I haven't practice the receiving game with Thresher yet, but believe I would hold the ball, set up a counter charge brick and try to force them into me, using tap passes to build momentum for turn two. There is some swing models I'd like to try in the build, like swapping Millstone at times for Windle, when I need extra punch, or when receiving switching VHonour with Jackstraw for better ball retrieval. I need to experiment with Grange receiving but just haven't yet, he is next on my to do list, once I get Thresher match ups down.

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4 hours ago, LouisvillePitch said:

I've tested out the team and so far just using Thresher, I am liking them. When kicking off, I set up ...

Interesting take. So Thresher, Peck, Tater, Millstone, vHonour and ?? (Ploughman, the new auto-include?). I'd certainly like to try this team out. I assume it's best against more footbally teams, or do you go for it against everyone (except Butchers or Union, as mentioned)?

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The build is Thresher, Peck, Tater, Millstone, VHonour, and Ploughman. Against Ox led Butchers it's a dice game or who gets who's captain first, same with VRage. The team it has the hardest match up is combo Masons of Granite, VHarmony, and VChisel. They really dictate how damage is done and can stop you from getting the take outs you want. It can play into Hunters because Theron wants to get to 8", and you can use cocksure and Millstone to negate the snare. Then just go 3" melee and beat the crap outta him. I think Mortician's with Scalpel will be harder, but we can handle Obulus in this build. Need more testing against other teams to see, still early into the testing phase. Think teams that want to sit back, it hurts bad, I think it will rip through the Alchemist led Smoke team, and as you said goal scoring teams that want to sit back and pass turn one to set up a goal run. Thresher's team can really disrupts goal runs, plus goal focus teams aren't take out heavy, so they have a harder time getting Tater and Thresher off of them. Though take it with a grain of salt, still feeling it out. I'm using Farmers in a league locally coming up, and will try Grange into some teams for sure and try and hammer out Thresher play.

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I played my first S4 game with Farmers against Morticians Strings of the spirit weaver. Here’s a bit long report but it was one of the best, most fun games I’ve ever played.

My setup was Grange, Bushel, Ploughman, vHonour, Windle and Peck. My aim was to go for 3 goals but still bring enough threat for takeouts. 

Won the roll so opponent was kicking, just what I wanted. I got the ball with Grange and parked him next to cover im a center position and passed the ball to Honour. I moved Ploughman and Windle to center to create some threat and hopefully get to slow the center game and creating open lines for Bushel. 

Opponent didnt respond how I wanted and he kept moving to the position in the centre but not opening any flank keeping Scalpel and Bonesaw in positions to counter Bushel.

I tried luring him more to the middle by moving Honour with a ball to the center behind my lines but he still didnt bite.

I was out of players so had to move with Bushel. Called the ball with cabbage punt/I’m open, moved to cover and passed to Peck.

(This move accidentally saved me from the goal against as opponent planned to move Bonesaw through the center (new S4 skill to ignore base)).

Last I moved Peck to position on the right flank.

Turn 2:

 Peck was in range of Granges aura getting respectable 3/6 kick. I started with Bushel, called the ball, dodged past Bonesaw sprinted to goal and shot short range goal. 

4-0. 

Next turn opponent got the ball to Bonesaw and I underestimated him the second time. Bonesaw somehow went through the centre with the ball to the left flank and finally passed the ball to secure position. 

I couldnt do anything to get the ball so went to do some damage with Windle. vGraves was at 4 health after Windle’s treatment and Ploughman finished the job. Graves to the grave and game is 

6-0.

Game was almost in the pocket and my troubles started. First, Casket cast heavy burden on Grange and then opponent finally got Scalpel to the close combat and damn she’s dangerous. With her ability to reposition my players, suddendly I find Grange with 6 influence sitting far away on my defensive zone being able to do nothing. 

Previously I had ignored Memory completely as ”what small puppet can do”? Well by getting the kill to Graves, i had to take two parting blows (Windle and Ploughman) and I still ignored healing as I wanted the momentum advantage.

Windle got surrounded by Vileswarm, Memory, Brainpan and got damaged badly. 

Turn 3.

Bonesaw got early goal from the right flank, nothing I could do so didnt even try to stop it.

6-4. 

I got ball back to Peck but I had to save Windle. During this Scalpel kept hitting Honor and got the kill. Windle gets hammered by the opponent but somehow holding up and not going down.

6-6. 

Now Peck was originally 10 inches from the goal but after Voodoo strings from Scalpel, he’s moved back almost next to Bonesaw. I took Peck to sprint away and kick the ball to open space trying to get it towards Bushel.

Turn 4:

Underestimated Bonesaw the third time. He still reached the open ball, got through the center, passed to Scalpel and dodged next to Grange to cause crowded out.

With Grange, best thing about him is the KD in first playbook result. I got KD first to Bonesaw and then to Scalpel. Did some damage, sprinted to center and passed the ball to Bushel.

Bushel got the ball, dodged past Graves safely and scored her second. 

10-6

After goal kick, ball went to Graves.

Turn 5.

I got to start through the momentum advantage but only barely. I could have gone for tackle with Bushel and scored third but time was running out. Decided to charge with Grange. Got the ball after second tackle and with the remainder of influence managed to kill Graves the second time.

12-6

Afterall, really fun and solid team to play but in the middle of the game I was in the ropes. Felt I cant get any takeouts on anyone or do anything. This was due to opponent moving my players with spirit bomb/voodoo strings/heavy burden combo.

New Bushel is amazing and fun to play. With Grange, even Peck is a solid footballer. With Honour/Ploughman pumping influence I had constantly enough to do what I wanted. 

Windle got one kill but otherwise he was just healing himself and keeping centre busy. Wonder if Tater would have been better with Aoe swipe. Honour was good. She moved markers couple of times and caused some distraction. 

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Used Grange three times now. My build is Grange, Peck, Windle, Tater, Jackstraw, and Ploughman. I find the list plays from strong. It is a takeout focus team, that once they get the ball will use it for a final score. Most turns after the first I am sitting on 14-15 influence for the coming turn. This causes a lot of momentum generation.  The damage on Grange is under perceived, but by being able to hold 6 gets far more done then you think. Some turns he is creating KDs and crowd outs which then in turns helps the rest of our low playbook damage players. I use Tate, because he has a good spike in damage when charging, and the counter charge is easy to keep going most the game with the other harvest droppers in the list. I do push Ploughman into fight more with this list, his early KD and pushes help setup the rest of the team. Windle is great at getting in there, even when he drops it was at a cost for the other team, in the lack of momentum generation for the turn. Jackstraw is my go in a crowd out guy, and ball holder, waiting for the turn to setup his goal run, on his terms. He also forces some bad placements of teams trying to get the ball from him to just port away to safety. Peck is there due to his heroic being so damn good, I'd add the Ass, but he just doesn't make the 12 cut. I could drop Harrow seeing how I have yet to even use him. With the high health pools, and constant pressure of damage, and attacks is the goal behind my team. The influence flux from the harvest markers means more models are doing more. The team as a whole has been performing solid. One model that hasn't made it is Fallow, I don't like the 1" melee myself, and really felt like if someone was pulled it would be hard to give up the counter charges from Tater. I feel like Grange plays as a reaper, but does the additional work of a planter, he is really good, I am sold! Hope that helps some?

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9 hours ago, LouisvillePitch said:

Used Grange three times now. My build is Grange, Peck, Windle, Tater, Jackstraw, and Ploughman. I find the list plays from strong. It is a takeout focus team, that once they get the ball will use it for a final score. Most turns after the first I am sitting on 14-15 influence for the coming turn. This causes a lot of momentum generation.  The damage on Grange is under perceived, but by being able to hold 6 gets far more done then you think. Some turns he is creating KDs and crowd outs which then in turns helps the rest of our low playbook damage players. I use Tate, because he has a good spike in damage when charging, and the counter charge is easy to keep going most the game with the other harvest droppers in the list. I do push Ploughman into fight more with this list, his early KD and pushes help setup the rest of the team. Windle is great at getting in there, even when he drops it was at a cost for the other team, in the lack of momentum generation for the turn. Jackstraw is my go in a crowd out guy, and ball holder, waiting for the turn to setup his goal run, on his terms. He also forces some bad placements of teams trying to get the ball from him to just port away to safety. Peck is there due to his heroic being so damn good, I'd add the Ass, but he just doesn't make the 12 cut. I could drop Harrow seeing how I have yet to even use him. With the high health pools, and constant pressure of damage, and attacks is the goal behind my team. The influence flux from the harvest markers means more models are doing more. The team as a whole has been performing solid. One model that hasn't made it is Fallow, I don't like the 1" melee myself, and really felt like if someone was pulled it would be hard to give up the counter charges from Tater. I feel like Grange plays as a reaper, but does the additional work of a planter, he is really good, I am sold! Hope that helps some?

I only play Grange while receiving, cause while kicking it's just is mental to not pick Tresher.
 

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I found even kicking I like Grange into some teams more then others. Verse Blacksmith's I kicked into with Grange and felt fine with it. My biggest opponent or team I want to face, but just haven't yet is Butchers. I'm not sure how I will play into that match up. I assume kicking will be Thresher with VHonour creating a second alpha from another big hitter, but still unsure about it. Think I have to kill Ox on the top of two or he just overwhelms the Farmers. 

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I thought I'd try this yesterday. 
Grange, Tater, Windle, Jackstraw, Ploughman, and Peck vs the Order using sBrisket, Benediction, sSpigot, Pride, Mist, and Harry.

Serious take down ability. I was able to take out Brisket, Mist, Harry, and Spigot, and was positioned to repeat if necessary (with them coming back at half health, of course) but Jackstraw moved in and took the goal for the win. His mobility is amazing. My opponent had me blocked and cornered, but the ability to place two harvest markers in an AOE and teleport to them meant I could pretty much ignore them all. 

Most of the game, Ploughman was given no influence. His 2 harvest markers, his 2" melee, and his True Path aura all meant that he was a great support for the rest of the team. He effectively blocked some shooters, and I did manage to strategically use his Broken Earth to control the pitch for a turn. 

I've never had that many Harvest markers on the pitch in a single turn. That was really eye opening. I'd start with maybe three, then Ploughman or Jackstraw would put two down, Tater or Windle would eat a couple, and I'd still end up with 5 on the pitch at the end of the turn. Consistently having 12 to 14 influence as a result, even when my Gameplay cards gave me -1, was really helpful. I am curious as to whether Thresher would have been as or even more effective, though. I didn't always need the extra Harvest marker Grange provided (after the first turn) and often used him as an attacker. There was at least one situation where a 3" melee would have been nice as well.

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15 minutes ago, mbdeyes said:

I thought I'd try this yesterday. 
Grange, Tater, Windle, Jackstraw, Ploughman, and Peck vs the Order using sBrisket, Benediction, sSpigot, Pride, Mist, and Harry.

Serious take down ability. I was able to take out Brisket, Mist, Harry, and Spigot, and was positioned to repeat if necessary (with them coming back at half health, of course) but Jackstraw moved in and took the goal for the win. His mobility is amazing. My opponent had me blocked and cornered, but the ability to place two harvest markers in an AOE and teleport to them meant I could pretty much ignore them all. 

Most of the game, Ploughman was given no influence. His 2 harvest markers, his 2" melee, and his True Path aura all meant that he was a great support for the rest of the team. He effectively blocked some shooters, and I did manage to strategically use his Broken Earth to control the pitch for a turn. 

I've never had that many Harvest markers on the pitch in a single turn. That was really eye opening. I'd start with maybe three, then Ploughman or Jackstraw would put two down, Tater or Windle would eat a couple, and I'd still end up with 5 on the pitch at the end of the turn. Consistently having 12 to 14 influence as a result, even when my Gameplay cards gave me -1, was really helpful. I am curious as to whether Thresher would have been as or even more effective, though. I didn't always need the extra Harvest marker Grange provided (after the first turn) and often used him as an attacker. There was at least one situation where a 3" melee would have been nice as well.

I’ve played that lineup with Thresher and it’s really good, you can fuel all three reapers pretty easily most turns and still have harvest markers left for abilities. Grange most likely just drags that list down, since while he provides more inf and markers, he doesn’t really do much himself so the two squaddie reapers have to do all the lifting.

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2 hours ago, Falkman said:

... Grange most likely just drags that list down, since while he provides more inf and markers, he doesn’t really do much himself so the two squaddie reapers have to do all the lifting.

That wasn't my experience. Grange was nearly as good as Thresher, when you look at how I actually used him. He gave the harvest marker and the extra influence, and all the damage on 4 or less results is the same as Thresher's. He has an earlier momentous KD and is only really missing the momentum on the first 2 dmg and an extra TAC die. Thresher only really gets better for damage on his last result and Grange can attack more often if he's loaded up with influence. 

I'm not at all saying Thresher is a bad choice. Mainly I missed the 3" melee, but using that would reduce his attacks even more. Grange was a nice, solid, and consistent player who did his fair share of damage. He took down Spigot, finished off Mist, and did his fair share vs Harry. 

Nothing beats Windle (on the Farmers) for straight up damage, but I may see if I can fit Fallow in at some point.

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8 hours ago, mbdeyes said:

I thought I'd try this yesterday. 
Grange, Tater, Windle, Jackstraw, Ploughman, and Peck vs the Order using sBrisket, Benediction, sSpigot, Pride, Mist, and Harry.

They didn't play vFangers? He makes a BIG difference vs. Windle - Resilience plus early pushes/:KD:s hurts Windle lots, plus once Windle is down, every point of INF on vFangers is a Ground Pound, which IS momentous damage on Windle and batters everyone Harry can push into vFang's melee. I've had a hard time facing off against vFangers, so much so I don't think I'd take Windle against him but swap in the donkey and possibly Harrow for the Marked Target to hunt down strikers and pop Resilience (Thresher captain).

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16 hours ago, mbdeyes said:

That wasn't my experience. Grange was nearly as good as Thresher, when you look at how I actually used him. He gave the harvest marker and the extra influence, and all the damage on 4 or less results is the same as Thresher's. He has an earlier momentous KD and is only really missing the momentum on the first 2 dmg and an extra TAC die. Thresher only really gets better for damage on his last result and Grange can attack more often if he's loaded up with influence. 

I'm not at all saying Thresher is a bad choice. Mainly I missed the 3" melee, but using that would reduce his attacks even more. Grange was a nice, solid, and consistent player who did his fair share of damage. He took down Spigot, finished off Mist, and did his fair share vs Harry.

Grange deals about as much damage as Thresher yes, but most of it is non-momentous which is a huge deal. The 4-5 extra momentum Thresher generates compared to Grange gives you a lot more flexibility when it comes to healing and choosing who gets to go first.

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Though I see some points on Grange, he still is a killer as well. Though he may not generate as much momentum as Thresher does, he brings more influence to the pitch, making many of the other teammates generate a lot of momentum. Grange helps the kick game as well, and the legendary with ignore first KD is huge for our counter attacks for the turn.

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On 12/14/2018 at 6:00 PM, S_A_T_S said:

They didn't play vFangers? He makes a BIG difference vs. Windle ....

He was concentrating on scoring so the only real heavy hitter was Benediction. 
I'll keep that in mind next time I face Fangtooth though. Last time I was playing a Corsair Fish team and just threw him off the pitch. I think that may have influenced the Order player's choices. ;)

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