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Perry89

Traps mechanics changing.

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Seeing as all traps are being "Simplified" and jaecar loosing bleed , maybe he will loose the bleed on his playbook and pick up Crucial artery. As noone really ever chose the bleed result. One can hope

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My gut says we won't see anything like a ground up rework on J, while he's been perhaps the closest we've had to an auto take for a good while, that's down to the failings of other players more than his own excesses. (Which SFG coughed to in one of the preview blogs.) 

Crucial artery would be nice, and as I've mentioned I wouldn't be surprised to see them give us another reason to use the pitfall marker now that it isn't a trap. 

If he retains nuGnS, AP and BTTS, gains Crucial Artery and another CP to use the Pitfall marker and replace Bleed and keeps the same stats and PB, I'd be very happy. 

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52 minutes ago, Azreal13 said:

If he retains nuGnS, AP and BTTS, gains Crucial Artery and another CP to use the Pitfall marker and replace Bleed and keeps the same stats and PB, I'd be very happy. 

And a machine gun.

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The bleed character player rarely got used, and as seen in previous blogs they are removing plays and traits that never got used ie Skulk. And if his trap doesn’t cause bleed anymore I’m wondering if there going to put it somewhere else? I don’t know how i feel about the generic change to the traps all being the same. Each trap had its own flavour and that was something i really enjoyed. Also another thing is that if they are all the same can we expect that the snare condition has remained the same?

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13 hours ago, Anudem said:

Let me expand on my initial thought. The change is strait up better for Chaska and fairly lateral for Jaecar (assuming he keeps his trap marker). My issue is Minx. Snare is great, but bumping the damage of her trap markers impacts how she plays. Her damage potential fairly minimal now and how models around her interact with those snares. A potential 6 damage dodging away from her or from a push gives your opponent some reason to pause and gauge their decisions. The worst Minx's snares do now is three damage and getting snared three times (eat those snares!). Not too scary.  I see models just setting off her traps because they can. Why wouldn't they? An extra two damage to remove potential snares to the rest of your models feels like a good trade for the opponent. I liked the pressure the Jawbone traps put on my opponent.

While this is true, new traps create a new dilemma for your opponent. With the old traps they could jog/charge in, clear the damage before/after the first attack and then keep attacking her as a 4/1 model. Now they have to choose - will they heal or clear snare? If Minx has marked for death up, they reallyyyy don't want to leave snare and that means hitting a 5/1 model. If they leave snare, there's a high chance their player is gonna get wrecked on the next activation. Snare also prevents players form just jogging in which is huge with Minx (jog, heal, hit). I think new traps really help her early game and snare will mitigate the dmg reduction by helping us get higher results and helping Fahad live the dream. :D New traps also bring another much needed source of snare to Skatha's team and enable the bear (especially with Marked for Death). I think we gain much more than we lose when it comes to Minx's traps. :)

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I believe they'll keep Jaecar trap unique and only one of a kind, I'm hoping this will be hte case based solely one the Jaecar's trap size

It will also allow us to preserve some trap variety

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46 minutes ago, Larhendiel said:

I believe they'll keep Jaecar trap unique and only one of a kind, I'm hoping this will be hte case based solely one the Jaecar's trap size

It will also allow us to preserve some trap variety

They literally say the opposite of that in the blog. Chaska, Jaecar and Minx will all have the same sort of trap.

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3 hours ago, GeroJr said:

While this is true, new traps create a new dilemma for your opponent. With the old traps they could jog/charge in, clear the damage before/after the first attack and then keep attacking her as a 4/1 model. Now they have to choose - will they heal or clear snare? If Minx has marked for death up, they reallyyyy don't want to leave snare and that means hitting a 5/1 model. If they leave snare, there's a high chance their player is gonna get wrecked on the next activation. Snare also prevents players form just jogging in which is huge with Minx (jog, heal, hit). I think new traps really help her early game and snare will mitigate the dmg reduction by helping us get higher results and helping Fahad live the dream. :D New traps also bring another much needed source of snare to Skatha's team and enable the bear (especially with Marked for Death). I think we gain much more than we lose when it comes to Minx's traps. :)

I'm willing to wait and find out. I never said it was bad, but that I didn't like this change. Minx's dynamic changes a lot and the fact remains that her potential damage output is (significantly?) lower. The other issue is Minx has no way to set off her own snare. Chaska and Jaecar can push models into a trap and keep going. This use to be ok with the Jawbone because it was a good way to balance her, now not so much.

 

I will say I welcome more access to snare, but I thought we'd get it somewhere else.

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She has momentous 2 on 2, and places extra traps on 3.  Her damage is only lower in any significant way against tough hide models where you are trying to set up a delayed burst of damage on a subsequent activation.  The addition of being able to put out Snare I think easily outweighs the loss of 1 damage from the traps.  Table time once we have all the cards will tell.

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On 9/21/2018 at 9:07 PM, Keel said:

Farmers don't have models for their markers either. I don't see trap markers needing specific representations now that they all do the same.

Farmers DO come with harvest markers, though, as part of the cardboard counters the PVC sets come with. Do the resin sets come with cardboard counter sets?

On 9/21/2018 at 9:07 PM, Keel said:

Any 30mm sized marker should do.

But SFG want to make the game simpler and easier to get into. A new player is not going to have spare 30mm bases hanging around (I'd never played a game that required 30mm bases before GB), and it's more work that someone spending £60 on a resin set wants to do, to make 5 30mm circles out of paper/card.

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So come October 13th, if you walk into your FLGS, and buy the Blessings of the Sun Father set, do you end up with a  model that has a dead play? I hope not. I hope they're doing something where Jacaer looses his ability to lay traps and instead get a special play utilizing that 40mm pit marker.

And just reread the article. Looks like Jaecar's getting an ability he can't use unless you go out and buy one of the other boxes. 😖

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22 minutes ago, Redtiger7 said:

So come October 13th, if you walk into your FLGS, and buy the Blessings of the Sun Father set, do you end up with a  model that has a dead play? I hope not. I hope they're doing something where Jacaer looses his ability to lay traps and instead get a special play utilizing that 40mm pit marker.

And just reread the article. Looks like Jaecar's getting an ability he can't use unless you go out and buy one of the other boxes. 😖

Or you could just buy or make three 30mm base markers...

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I'm not really seeing the issue with the whole markers thing unless you are a brand new player. Even then a set of twelve 30mm bases will run you an additional $7 on Amazon. Or if you can ask someone you're playing against for proxies or share 30mm bases.

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Which is all extra money, extra work, extra confusion and frustration (for the  new players).

I'm just saying they could have handled this better

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Or you can just cut out 3 30mm cardboard circles for the first few games. I mean, they are trying to streamline the game and I would say the changes make it more rookie friendly. If someone is put off by one useles 40 mm marker or doesn't know how to get/make 3 30 mm ones (before you get them with Chaska and Minx anyway), I'm not sure Hunters are the right choice for a person so easily frustrated. ;)

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12 minutes ago, GeroJr said:

Or you can just cut out 3 30mm cardboard circles for the first few games. I mean, they are trying to streamline the game and I would say the changes make it more rookie friendly. If someone is put off by one useles 40 mm marker or doesn't know how to get/make 3 30 mm ones (before you get them with Chaska and Minx anyway), I'm not sure Hunters are the right choice for a person so easily frustrated. ;)

Too much work. It's easier to victimize a fictional noob because the potential for frustration in an imaginary event is too much to comprehend. Way easier for a new player to remember all the different type of traps and their interations than to cut three circles or Heaven forbid ask the opponent for proxy bases.

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Ok folks, let’s keep it light :)

It’s a good thing for simplicity and new players if there’s only one type of trap.

But while I’m really hobby minded, and have piles of spare bases, circle cutting gear, and would enjoy making a bunch of traps, some people just don’t like that kind of thing. Granted, if they’re buying the resin hunters I assume a degree of hobby experience, but still not ideal for those people. 

And I agree, as it stands with what we know so far, it puts the hunters in a weird spot where the sun father box contains none of the essential traps for Jaecar and one 40mm random useless base. That said, I assume SFG are aware of that, and that people will be annoyed with it - they may yet have something planned, like a change to the resin set so Jaecar comes with a few 30mm instead of a 40mm.

Until S4 breaks proper, and we’ve seen all the rules for everything, it’s hard to say what the answer is or whether being annoyed is warranted. But it is definitely a peculiar position where a fairly new resin set is out of step with the rules!

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Exactly. Exactly how small is the subset of the Venn diagram between "smart enough to be able to learn how to play the game" and "prepared to spend a decent amount of cash on models" that reads "can't be arsed/is unable to make or source 5 30mm circles so throws up hands and gives up?"

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8 hours ago, AaronWilson. said:

Wow some people are really worked up by toy soldiers, 1 DMG & Snared across the board feels fairly solid.

Weird to have discussion about said toy soldier game on a forum.

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I'm not bothered at all if Jaecar's trap become illegal due to lack of any rules to use in any form other than decoration.
I don't mind sBrisket being moved from my second fav Guild to another one that I have no Lion for.

I played Bretonnia, and before them I had Dogs of War and Regiments of Renown with pretty badly painted Kislev.

But as GW firstly squated off entire factions, then entire system, nowadays Privateer Press is going to squat some of its models.
Its seems common, and fashionable to discontinue product lines, therefore all we should do is smile and buy while constantly adjusting :)

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