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First Engineers Game - probably into farmers

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I have all the minis but I'm only bringing  seven as they're not all built yet - I have Ballista, Mother, Hoist, Ratchet, Velocity, Harriet and Colossus.

Who do I lose? Any other top tips and things to remember for a first engineers game into farmers?

Cheers!

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3 hours ago, Silvs said:

Drop Colossus and you'll have a very good team. Any tips? Don't get too close ;]

Sounds fair!

Guess I'm looking for a 3-0/2-2. Don't know where the takeouts would come from though. Those farmer health pools always look super intimidating! Haven't played them much with any team yet

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The take-outs probably come from a Tooled Up Ballista. Potentially, that's 4 DMG from Deadbolt and another four attacks that have a good chance to reach column 3 for another 3 damage each. it's especially effective if you can activate Ballista last and get back-to-back activations.

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Ballista isn't a run-up-the-pitch, beat you up kind of captain. He may look that way, but at 3/1, he's still a little squishy, even with Tough Hide. Set up your gun line and hang back for the first turn, earning some momentum from your ranged attacks.

FWIW, I like Colossus, but I'm taking him less and less lately in games around my meta. 

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1 hour ago, skcpae said:

FWIW, I like Colossus, but I'm taking him less and less lately in games my meta. 

Colossus is a great piece.  He is NOT a beater.  He is a scorer and a reshaper, as well as a Ballista setup piece. Charge in, Unexpected Arrival to isolate the target, Singled Out on the wrap, KD next hit, or U/A then SO if no wrap on the charge.

However, like every Engineers player i don't take, other options may be better.  Harriet/ Hoist, for instance.

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On 15.5.2018 at 4:17 PM, skcpae said:

Ballista isn't a run-up-the-pitch, beat you up kind of captain. He may look that way, but at 3/1, he's still a little squishy, even with Tough Hide.

Well, it works for me. :D

It's true that Ballista can get taken out, but making the most out of the time until then is what he's about IMO. Kicking off with Ballista puts a lot of pressure on the opponent in my experience. 

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7 hours ago, Ruffy said:

Well, it works for me. :D

It's true that Ballista can get taken out, but making the most out of the time until then is what he's about IMO. Kicking off with Ballista puts a lot of pressure on the opponent in my experience. 

Fair enough. I'll never disparage the tactics of a fellow cog-head. ;)

If you kick off with Ballista, when do you activate him? I feel leaving him up the pitch is an opening for the other team to come smash his face.

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10 minutes ago, skcpae said:

Fair enough. I'll never disparage the tactics of a fellow cog-head. ;)

If you kick off with Ballista, when do you activate him? I feel leaving him up the pitch is an opening for the other team to come smash his face.

Most of the time, he activates last. There's usually no getting to Ballista without teamwork actions and if the kickoff gets to a good spot, that will take some activations, but only if the opponent even tries. I usually deploy Ballista dead center and have models to recover free balls on both sides, so Ballista can jog to either side and the opponent better get that ball fast or I will. :D

In addition, Ballista can get "covered" by Compound's countercharge-bubble and few models can take Ballista out in one activation. There's usually also some Momentum available from Momentous Inspiration Blast Earths to shake KDs or Bonus Time Deadbolt. In my games, Tooled Up is pretty much always on either Ballista or Hoist.

Edit: since the kicking team gets the last activation, by the time Ballista activates the opponent has either stayed out of Ballista's melee threat range and in a very defensive position, or Ballista is in range and can go to town, often racking up quite some Momentum for possible back-to-back activations. Not going in and doing ranged damage against a defensive opponent can add up quite fast, too, and that's also where Second Wind becomes quite usefull. 

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The main advantage that Engineers have over Farmers is that Farmers have no models that can hold to the ball and we have a whole load of models that can easily get it off them.  Therefore, I would always recommend to play an aggressive football team against Farmers.  My 6 would be:  Ballista, Mother, Hoist, Ratchet, Velocity, Colossus.  The last may get a lot of dislike but if you play him on the wings, you'll find that the Farmers can't keep up with them (they generally prefer to bunch up in midfield, 4" away from each other).  If you play aggressively, you should be able to score 3 goals against them before they can take out too make of your players.

In my opinion, Engineers and Fish are Farmers' worst match up, so the odds are in your favour.  Good luck. 

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22 hours ago, Kingpash said:

The main advantage that Engineers have over Farmers is that Farmers have no models that can hold to the ball and we have a whole load of models that can easily get it off them.  Therefore, I would always recommend to play an aggressive football team against Farmers.  My 6 would be:  Ballista, Mother, Hoist, Ratchet, Velocity, Colossus.  The last may get a lot of dislike but if you play him on the wings, you'll find that the Farmers can't keep up with them (they generally prefer to bunch up in midfield, 4" away from each other).  If you play aggressively, you should be able to score 3 goals against them before they can take out too make of your players.

In my opinion, Engineers and Fish are Farmers' worst match up, so the odds are in your favour.  Good luck. 

Instinctively it feels like I should be playing for three goals into farmers. In the end my friend accidentally picked up his malifaux case and had to use my spare six hunters that another friend wasn't using! Anyway, I ended up winning 12-0 with three goals in the third turn! Obviously he was pretty disadvantaged using a hunters b team, when he hasn't used them before.

I kicked with velocity, trying to pressure a turn one goal, like I would with Mist, but unless I'm missing something, she seems to struggle with that. I miss Mist, but it's nice to have four die kicks across the team. Does anyone put on good kick off pressure for a turn one goal?

Managed to recover the ball, and missed my legendary shot with Ballista in turn 2.

Recovered it again turn 3 and scored a tap in with Hoist true repping burrow. 

Bad kick off scatter for him gave the ball to velocity. He pinned her with Theron, but she dodged into shooting range and scored.

Harriet then dislodged the ball from Ulfr with with a free sucker punch, jogged to recover it and drop it for mother, who dropped it for Ballista to score the winner. Harriet's zero inf activation can be super useful! 

They're a fun team who I think will need a fair amount of practice to get competitive on the clock. Will also need a lot of practise to make takeouts more viable and mitigate the inherent "swinginess" of ranged character plays - it's all too easy to miss them and I like reliability. It's one of the things I never really worked through with hunters

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If i'm kicking with Velocity, I usually only give her 2inf.  She won't have pressure to grab the ball in first activation (unless the enemy is REALLY close) but if you need it, you can have it from second activation.  For this, I would usually put 3inf on Ratchet, use 1 to Tool Up Hoist (who has 4inf for double Blast Earth), 2inf to shoot Blast Earth onto the ball-recovery model (staying within 4" of Ballista and Velocity) and generate momentum to Overclock Velocity.  This gives her the option to charge, acrobatic, and score if she gets the opportunity later in the turn.  In my opinion, that's the most efficient way to use her for the kick-off.

My kick-off team and inf allocation would normally be:

Ballista (2inf) - Deadbolt.  3dmg, 1mom.

Mother (0inf) - nest marker.

Ratchet (3inf) - as above.  2dmg+, +1/-1mom.

Hoist (4inf) - 2xBlast Earth.  6dmg+, 2mom.

Compound (1inf) - Horrific Odour.

Velocity (2inf) - charge, 2x attacks/goal run.  0dmg, 1-2mom.

 

After receiving, this should put you on 4-5 mom, having done around 10dmg to a single model (if you're feeling mean) and ready to score a turn at the top of the second turn.  Not a bad place to be and more than most other teams can generate without the ball.

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