Jump to content
kaladorm

How do I Siren?

Recommended Posts

Hi folks, you might remember me from such posts as 'When to vBrisket' or 'I forgot how to Graves'. Like an ADHD child who just guzzled 2L of Mountain Dew, I've  now moved my attention onto Fish.

I have mostly played Shark, as a way of improving my football game, and with only a single Corsair game (that guy is a machine!). I have played about 5-6 games and failed to use either Siren or vSiren effectively. I need your help.

With only 3inf I feel Siren doesn't quite get the job done as a ball snatcher, as Seduced takes all her inf and she can't pass it away. I realised that I should probably be charging with her and hitting the MOM playbook result, but in subsequent turns being an engaged TAC 3 model means it takes some effort to get her out of there again. Siren did get me a snapshot winner in my first game, but any other fast/kicker model (fishermen....) would have done. Eventually I dropped her from my list, and run Shark, Salt, Hag, Sakana, Angel, Greyscales. 

Onto Corsair then, I took vSiren for her Dread Gaze aura thinking to neuter the opposing teams attacks in the scrum. In fact, like my games with Siren, she hovered on the edges and I don't think I gave her a single influence the whole game. She just wasn't needed, but also didn't do much to threaten anyone either. Corsair and A&G meant that by the time I could activate her there was no need as the opp had been knocked down and crowded out already.

My tournament 8 so far looks like this, with space for 2 more:

Shark, Corsair, Salt, Angel, Hag, Greyscales, Sakana, A&G.

I keep looking at the Sirens and think I need them - particularly oSiren for her Seduced vs Engineers. I need your help in figuring out how to use them well, what matchups they fit in, and why.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Siren's best use is making someone pass the ball / kick it back to free space. It forces your opponent to either keep out of range of Sirens Seduce, or unsnap the ball. You can you Lure to drag players out of position (Shark can kill someone with a few crowd outs) or at the very worst charge, and take some form of momentous dodges. 

Got to be careful with her though, unless you're running Kraken (I see you're not, which is fair) she dies super, super fast. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since her max inf was reduced down to three I find that she’s not doing much in my games. I’ve started testing switching her out for Angel instead and so far that has worked well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm in no way an expert with OSiren, however - I've found that putting 3 inf on her is more of a zoning play than actually expecting seduced to steal the ball. Most competent opponents will play around it, but you can use this to your advantage by pushing the ball carrier away from Siren and into threat range of Shark/Corsair/Sakana etc. 

 

Has anyone else found this?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with Lumpyseven, putting 3 on her gives the threat of Seduction that your opponent can't ignore.  They may ignore the threat and then you have a Seduction to roll, or they may move the ball away and then you have 3 Inf that generates a Momentum on 1 net hit (might still need a crowd out to help there though with TAC 3) or a Lure to put someone out of position.  She does die ridiculously easy though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually think oSiren is still amazing. Definitely not quite the threat she was before, still the only model I run every game. Obviously the risk there is that she presents a significant take out opportunity for anyone, but her strengths make this worth it for me.

Lure and Seduced are the main reason people take her. The threat of both these plays is game changing in that it forces your opponent to change their approach to the game. They force your opponent to make decisions throughout the game in terms of how they play the ball, how they engage the scrum, and how they set up for future turns.

As a 7/9 MOV model with 2" melee, Siren's ability to get engaged and generate momentum or hit Seduced out of the playbook is pretty ridiculous. Hell, she's even got a decent goal threat range. So normally you can leave her well away from any threat and then bring her in by taking advantage of her 11" threat. The 2" melee is particularly important because even if she isn't directly impacting the game in a significant way, she's still providing Gang Ups and Crowd Outs.

The last thing that she doesn't get enough credit for is her access to damage. 2 damage on two results is nothing to sneeze at. With a couple of Gang Ups, she's can wrap on low defense models and put out a decent amount of damage. Obviously, you don't want to be doing this every turn, but it provides her a kind of flexibility that is pretty rare in Fish. It actually strikes me as pretty strange that oSiren has better damage potential than vSiren.

Speaking of vSiren, I'm not really sure what she does that warrants taking her over oSiren. I like Shadowlike on a 7/9 MOV model and Dread Gaze is obviously good, but for me it just pales in comparison to the combination of Lure and Seduced. Whereas oSiren can really fill whatever need I have at any given moment and works well with both captains, I still haven't found much of a use for vSiren since the errata. Might be a place for her against Midas Alchs or even Brewers, but I still feel like oSiren brings more than enough to both match ups. In my mind, vSiren isn't good enough to warrant a place over Kraken or Angel, both of whom are niche models but significantly stronger in their roles than vSiren is in her's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think I'm sold on oSiren here, and perhaps I was expecting too much in terms of direct impact but as a 'when needed' piece. By having Hag, oSiren and Salt not need much in the way of influence, I'm free to load up Shark, Sakana and Greyscales to do their thing every turn. I think she also makes the cut for me against a team like Engineers with close control, and possibly Masons as a way of pulling counter-chargers out of position.

This makes my tournament 10 look like Shark, Corsair, Salt, Angel, Greyscales, Hag, Jac, Sakana, oSiren, A&G.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with a lot of what's posted here.  oSiren is in both my shark and corsair lists.  She represents a whole side of the field that the other team has to be wary of because after I kick a goal, they run the risk of being seduced.  Lure is also particularly handy to pull into corsair range or to provide Shark a bounce off point. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My line-up has been:  Shark, Salt, Sakana, Greyscales, Jac, and oSiren.  I agree that when Siren was reduced to 3 Inf, it was a big game changer and admittedly she does much less.  However, I typically put her on the side of the field with Jac.  A well timed lure, paired with Jac's ability to push someone off the board can close down an entire part of the field.  And, of course, if that doesn't work using her to force a pass is fantastic! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

vet Siren is a goal scorer that has a nice side benefit of when she generated that momentous result (probably 2 with that wrap) to score a goal, she also made retailating against her team harder.  She's also great as a back sweeper, picking up dead balls in the back field and moving them upfield.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×