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As Goseki stated, both before or after movement. In the FAQ I've this:

CHARACTER ACTIVATIONS

Character Movement/Attacks

Your options are:

  • Move any number of nodes (spending moved nodes minus 1 - since first one is free) and then attack once with each equipped weapon in your hands
  • Attack once with each equipped weapon in your hands and then move any number of nodes (spending moved nodes minus 1 - since first one is free)

The only way of moving before and after an attack or the other way around would be if your weapon's attack provides additional movement (which is not related to your base movement) or with a heroic like "Berserk Charge"!

Also, potential weapons in your backpack slot stating they can be used in the backpack slot, can also be used to attack with once, as they overrule the "in your hands" rule.

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13 minutes ago, Replect said:

As Goseki stated, both before or after movement. In the FAQ I've this:

CHARACTER ACTIVATIONS

Character Movement/Attacks

Your options are:

  • Move any number of nodes (spending moved nodes minus 1 - since first one is free) and then attack once with each equipped weapon in your hands
  • Attack once with each equipped weapon in your hands and then move any number of nodes (spending moved nodes minus 1 - since first one is free)

The only way of moving before and after an attack or the other way around would be if your weapon's attack provides additional movement (which is not related to your base movement) or with a heroic like "Berserk Charge"!

Also, potential weapons in your backpack slot stating they can be used in the backpack slot, can also be used to attack with once, as they overrule the "in your hands" rule.

Don't know if that has been clarified already. But what about weapons that allow the players to move before or after an attack?

Well I guess afterwards is easy, you are in range of an enemy, hit him and move. No problem here.

What about the move that happens before you strike, though? I know it works well wtih bosses, since you can initiate the attack, move from one arc into another and then strike. So you always stay in range (if we assume we use a range 0 weapon).

But. Can you declare an attack even if you've got no enemies in range to move that extra node and then attack an enemy?

Or would it only be like: You start your attack on the same node as one enemy, move to another node with another enemy and then hit that second enemy.

 

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"When a character chooses to dodge while on a boss’s node, they can ignore the normal rules for boss arcs and instead move to any arc or onto any adjacent node."

Dodging onto the boss's node needs me to stay in the same arc or same as above when on the boss's node? Just wondering if it really just works in one direction...

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Possibly a silly question, but one that has been bugging me - Embers reduce damage taken when you are taking 3+ damage. Does this come into effect before the block reduction is applied or after?

That is, I have an Ember, I'm being hit for 4 damage and I block 2, am I:

  • going to take 2 damage (under the Ember's threshhold and thus it does nothing) 

OR

  • going to take 1 damage because the Ember reduced the original 4 to 3 before I blocked 2?

Thoughts?

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15 minutes ago, duke_bonez said:

Possibly a silly question, but one that has been bugging me - Embers reduce damage taken when you are taking 3+ damage. Does this come into effect before the block reduction is applied or after?

That is, I have an Ember, I'm being hit for 4 damage and I block 2, am I:

  • going to take 2 damage (under the Ember's threshhold and thus it does nothing) 

OR

  • going to take 1 damage because the Ember reduced the original 4 to 3 before I blocked 2?

Thoughts?

The Ember reduces damage that you would suffer. So it would only account for unblocked damage.

IE- if the enemy attacks for four and you block two, then you take two damage, not one.

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Another silly question: Bleed: "When a model that has a Bleed token suffers damage, it suffers 2 additional damage. Then remove the Bleed token."

What is considered suffering damage? If I deal 1 damage to a Hollow Soldier that's marked with Bleed, will it:

  • Die (1 damage from attack + 2 damage from bleed - 1 Hollow Soldier Armor = DEATH)
  • Laugh at me (1 damage from attack - 1 Hollow Soldier Armor = 0 Damage, Bleed doesn't take effect)

Thoughts?

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8 minutes ago, duke_bonez said:

Another silly question: Bleed: "When a model that has a Bleed token suffers damage, it suffers 2 additional damage. Then remove the Bleed token."

What is considered suffering damage? If I deal 1 damage to a Hollow Soldier that's marked with Bleed, will it:

  • Die (1 damage from attack + 2 damage from bleed - 1 Hollow Soldier Armor = DEATH)
  • Laugh at me (1 damage from attack - 1 Hollow Soldier Armor = 0 Damage, Bleed doesn't take effect)

Thoughts?

Bleed ignores armor, so it's really good for those targets with high block values. :)

However, I'm pretty sure you'd have to do damage in order to trigger it in the first place. So if you don't beat the block value you can't trigger the Bleed.

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9 hours ago, Ragnara said:

Don't know if that has been clarified already. But what about weapons that allow the players to move before or after an attack?

Well I guess afterwards is easy, you are in range of an enemy, hit him and move. No problem here.

What about the move that happens before you strike, though? I know it works well wtih bosses, since you can initiate the attack, move from one arc into another and then strike. So you always stay in range (if we assume we use a range 0 weapon).

But. Can you declare an attack even if you've got no enemies in range to move that extra node and then attack an enemy?

Or would it only be like: You start your attack on the same node as one enemy, move to another node with another enemy and then hit that second enemy.

 

Weapon effects do not "use up" any of the normal aspects of your activation.

If you recover stamina from a weapon ability, that doesn't replace recovering stamina at the start of your activation. If a weapon includes a shift icon, you still have your normal movement.

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1 minute ago, DC said:

Weapon effects do not "use up" any of the normal aspects of your activation.

If you recover stamina from a weapon ability, that doesn't replace recovering stamina at the start of your activation. If a weapon includes a shift icon, you still have your normal movement.

Yes, that I know.

I'm just wondering if you could use this ability to move another free step towards an enemy and then attack or if you have to be in range of an enemy in the first place to activate this effect.

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50 minutes ago, duke_bonez said:

Another silly question: Bleed: "When a model that has a Bleed token suffers damage, it suffers 2 additional damage. Then remove the Bleed token."

What is considered suffering damage? If I deal 1 damage to a Hollow Soldier that's marked with Bleed, will it:

  • Die (1 damage from attack + 2 damage from bleed - 1 Hollow Soldier Armor = DEATH)
  • Laugh at me (1 damage from attack - 1 Hollow Soldier Armor = 0 Damage, Bleed doesn't take effect)

Thoughts?

Block and Resist "reduce the damage" a model would suffer. If a model does not suffer damage after factoring in Block/Resist, then it has not suffered damage.

You don't add any red cubes to your character board or wound tokens to the enemy model or trigger "when it suffers damage" effects.

EDIT - This answer also applies to the Ember question. If you would suffer 2 damage after Block/Resist, then that's 2 damage (not 3). @Ashraam is correct on both counts.

7 minutes ago, Ragnara said:

Yes, that I know.

I'm just wondering if you could use this ability to move another free step towards an enemy and then attack or if you have to be in range of an enemy in the first place to activate this effect.

No, you don't have to be in range before the attack portion of the weapon ability.

1 hour ago, Replect said:

"When a character chooses to dodge while on a boss’s node, they can ignore the normal rules for boss arcs and instead move to any arc or onto any adjacent node."

Dodging onto the boss's node needs me to stay in the same arc or same as above when on the boss's node? Just wondering if it really just works in one direction...

It works the way it says it does in the rules.

When you roll towards a boss, you reach the boss from the direction you rolled from. When you're already under the boss's feet, you have more tactical flexibility of what direction to roll.

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24 minutes ago, DC said:

Block and Resist "reduce the damage" a model would suffer. If a model does not suffer damage after factoring in Block/Resist, then it has not suffered damage.

You don't add any red cubes to your character board or wound tokens to the enemy model or trigger "when it suffers damage" effects.

EDIT - This answer also applies to the Ember question. If you would suffer 2 damage after Block/Resist, then that's 2 damage (not 3). @Ashraam is correct on both counts.

First - thanks =]. That makes sense - but...

"If the enemy's Block or Resist value equals (or exceeds) the damage total, the enemy suffers 0 damage."

So the question is: is suffering 0 damage considered suffering damage?

As far as Embers go... I'm forced to agree. Rereading the rules clearly defines suffering damage as damage taken, not received. Again thanks =].

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5 minutes ago, duke_bonez said:

First - thanks =]. That makes sense - but...

"If the enemy's Block or Resist value equals (or exceeds) the damage total, the enemy suffers 0 damage."

So the question is: is suffering 0 damage considered suffering damage?

As far as Embers go... I'm forced to agree. Rereading the rules clearly defines suffering damage as damage taken, not received. Again thanks =].

Take another look at the text you quoted.

" If a model does not suffer damage after factoring in Block/Resist, then it has not suffered damage. "

So taking 0 damage isn't considered suffering damage.  :)

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3 minutes ago, Ashraam said:

Take another look at the text you quoted.

" If a model does not suffer damage after factoring in Block/Resist, then it has not suffered damage. "

...errr, I might be blind but where is that quote from? I'm just looking at the rulebook p. 22 and I don't see it. <shrugs>

The full quote I have is as follows:

"In general, weapons cause physical damage, and players will subtract the target's Block value from the damage total. Spells or elemental weapons cause magical damage instead, so players will subtract the target's Resist value from the damage total. In either case, the enemy suffers the resulting damage. If the enemy's Block or Resist value equals (or exceeds) the damage total, the enemy suffers 0 damage. Place a number of wound tokens beside the enemy model equal to the damage it suffered. If the total number of wound tokens on the enemy equals or exceeds its Heath, it is destroyed. Remove the model and the wound tokens from the tile."

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Boss encounter: Target is in bottom left corner, Winged Knight facing for example east in the upper right corner. Now he does "Diagonal Uppercut" which includes an attack followed by movement of 1 away from the nearest character. Since I'm alone, that's me in the other corner. Now I assume he doesn't turn at all, since there is no node farther from me, right? Or does he turn or could I decide to turn him (if I feel like it gives me an advantage)?

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8 minutes ago, duke_bonez said:

...errr, I might be blind but where is that quote from? I'm just looking at the rulebook p. 22 and I don't see it. <shrugs>

The full quote I have is as follows:

"In general, weapons cause physical damage, and players will subtract the target's Block value from the damage total. Spells or elemental weapons cause magical damage instead, so players will subtract the target's Resist value from the damage total. In either case, the enemy suffers the resulting damage. If the enemy's Block or Resist value equals (or exceeds) the damage total, the enemy suffers 0 damage. Place a number of wound tokens beside the enemy model equal to the damage it suffered. If the total number of wound tokens on the enemy equals or exceeds its Heath, it is destroyed. Remove the model and the wound tokens from the tile."

Sorry, that quote came from DC's comment, not the book.

I'll admit I'm at a bit of a loss to explain how suffering 0 damage is the same thing as not suffering any damage at all without sounding snarky.

To clarify, how else would you state that a model hasn't taken damage if you don't consider 0 to be "no damage"? 

And BTW, DC is employed with SFG and is here to answer rules questions, so you can consider his answers to be "official" from a rules standpoint. :)

 

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13 minutes ago, Ashraam said:

Sorry, that quote came from DC's comment, not the book.

I'll admit I'm at a bit of a loss to explain how suffering 0 damage is the same thing as not suffering any damage at all without sounding snarky.

To clarify, how else would you state that a model hasn't taken damage if you don't consider 0 to be "no damage"? 

And BTW, DC is employed with SFG and is here to answer rules questions, so you can consider his answers to be "official" from a rules standpoint. :)

 

Thanks for the clarification =].

To answer your question, "suffers no damage / doesn't suffer damage" is different from "suffers 0 damage," at least in some games, specifically because of things like conditions triggered by taking damage regardless of the amount. The reason it matters here is because if they are the same then the Bleed condition is useless against most of the minions who only have 1 Starting Health. Alternatively it becomes an auto-kill combo - Kukri in one hand to cause Bleed and a dagger in the other to trigger it, and I wasn't sure based on the rules which way it was meant to go. 

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5 minutes ago, duke_bonez said:

Thanks for the clarification =].

To answer your question, "suffers no damage / doesn't suffer damage" is different from "suffers 0 damage," at least in some games, specifically because of things like conditions triggered by taking damage regardless of the amount. The reason it matters here is because if they are the same then the Bleed condition is useless against most of the minions who only have 1 Starting Health. Alternatively it becomes an auto-kill combo - Kukri in one hand to cause Bleed and a dagger in the other to trigger it, and I wasn't sure based on the rules which way it was meant to go. 

Okay, that's fair. :)

You're right that it's pretty useless against most of the weaker minions. I think where it really shines is on enemies with high block values or when used in conjunction with Poison.

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4 hours ago, Replect said:

Boss encounter: Target is in bottom left corner, Winged Knight facing for example east in the upper right corner. Now he does "Diagonal Uppercut" which includes an attack followed by movement of 1 away from the nearest character. Since I'm alone, that's me in the other corner. Now I assume he doesn't turn at all, since there is no node farther from me, right? Or does he turn or could I decide to turn him (if I feel like it gives me an advantage)?

He'll turn so his butt (also known as his "back arc" in rules terms) faces away from you. He'll try to move back 1. He'll hit the wall and stay in that node.

 

4 hours ago, duke_bonez said:

Thanks for the clarification =].

To answer your question, "suffers no damage / doesn't suffer damage" is different from "suffers 0 damage," at least in some games, specifically because of things like conditions triggered by taking damage regardless of the amount. The reason it matters here is because if they are the same then the Bleed condition is useless against most of the minions who only have 1 Starting Health. Alternatively it becomes an auto-kill combo - Kukri in one hand to cause Bleed and a dagger in the other to trigger it, and I wasn't sure based on the rules which way it was meant to go. 

In this game, "no damage" and "0 damage" are equivalent. I appreciate a good semantic debate as much as the next guy, but 0 damage simply isn't "suffering damage."

You are correct that the Bleed condition is focused on multi-wound targets in contrast to the Poison condition that focuses on single-wound targets. I would not recommend the Kukris for a battle against a bunch of single-wound targets.

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6 hours ago, DC said:

He'll turn so his butt (also known as his "back arc" in rules terms) faces away from you. He'll try to move back 1. He'll hit the wall and stay in that node.

I see, so basically the related step from the summary:

  1. If the enemy is a boss and the movement is farther away from "nearest" or "aggro," turn the boss so the centre of its back arc faces an adjacent node that is farther from that character. If there isn't any node, turn the boss so the centre of its front arc faces an adjacent node that is closer to that character (you are now done if it is a 0 distance move)
  2. Move the boss onto the node directly behind it or the non-boss enemy one node farther from "nearest" or "aggro" as appropriate. (you are now done if there isn't any node)

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Campaign mode - Dashing through: "...Immediately place character models on the entry nodes of a tile connected to the current one."

Will that replace the basic rule: "Once you’ve set up the enemies, terrain, and traps, place the character models on the entry nodes beside the door aligned with the tile the party moved from."

Basically, if I dash through, can I still rearrange the characters position after I've set up the encounter I stumbled upon then, or am I stuck with the decision since the basic rule is overruled in that moment?

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Quick question about the Spell "Force" :

Because attacks without dice rolling are not real attacks, can I drag an enemy closer instead of pushing one node farther away? 

 

And another question:

Assassins heroic ability:

Normaly for dodging: 1 Stamina, move or not, then roll. 

But the ability states that you first roll. So when do you say you will use your attack? And is it lost if you dont succeed in the roll? 

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Looking for some clarification regarding the LHS and his pushing mechanic.

If I am on the same node when he pushes me, am I pushed once for 5 damage, and then (provided I'm the nearest player again), pushed again for another 5 damage?

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22 minutes ago, Photomic said:

Looking for some clarification regarding the LHS and his pushing mechanic.

If I am on the same node when he pushes me, am I pushed once for 5 damage, and then (provided I'm the nearest player again), pushed again for another 5 damage?

No, check out Pushing rules on page 25. When you already share a node with the enemy the initial Push is just a Push, not a Push Attack so it does not deal damage. Push attacks require the enemy to enter your node.

Also note that the Nearest Player is determined at the start of LHS activation and it won't change, so the same target you chose before the Push will still be the target of the Push Attack.

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I just ask my questions again in hope somebody can answer them. 

 

Question about the Spell "Force" :

Because attacks without dice rolling are not real attacks, can I drag an enemy closer instead of pushing one node farther away? 

 

And another question:

Assassins heroic ability:

Normaly for dodging: 1 Stamina, move or not, then roll. 

But the ability states that you first roll. So when do you say you will use your ability? And is it lost if you dont succeed in the roll? 

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17 minutes ago, fabsl said:

I just ask my questions again in hope somebody can answer them. 

 

Question about the Spell "Force" :

Because attacks without dice rolling are not real attacks, can I drag an enemy closer instead of pushing one node farther away? 

 

And another question:

Assassins heroic ability:

Normaly for dodging: 1 Stamina, move or not, then roll. 

But the ability states that you first roll. So when do you say you will use your ability? And is it lost if you dont succeed in the roll? 

When you push an enemy, you decide on which adjacent node he's getting pushed to.

 

And the assassin...it's like a..."He already did that" kind of move. You roll for dodge, if you succeed you can activate the ability and basically retroactively decide that your assassin stabbed the enemy right before he left the node.

He still has to be in range though. So if you evade the attack of a sentinel from one node away while wielding a 0 range weapon, you can't hit him with this attack. Not even if you move into his node, I'd say, because you execute the attack before dodging.

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