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      Training Ground   02/14/2018

      There’s a new section in the guild ball area designed to help rookies, but it needs others to help out - why not write a post for it? Anything that’s good for people to know, whatever faction they’re starting out with!
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Gutter

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20 minutes ago, FearLord said:

1 more TAC but she ignores 1 ARM...

It's often overlooked that that is really good. It's not just about Scything Blow, but that was the misconception many Mortician Players had, too. The Mythical Average, as the Battlehammer guys called it, is 4/1. A TAC of 6 is statistically worse against that than a Tac of five with AP. But oh well, there are people who won't like it, so whatever.

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8 hours ago, Banjulhu said:

So Chain Grab is just Kraken's Drag now just without the ability to spend inf to use it.

Does make you wonder why they didn't just give her Drag? They gave it a generic name so it could be used by more players, and charging double for longer range Chaingrab isn't that bad/overpowered.

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22 minutes ago, S_A_T_S said:

Does make you wonder why they didn't just give her Drag? They gave it a generic name so it could be used by more players, and charging double for longer range Chaingrab isn't that bad/overpowered.

It's the threat range of it. Drag is on 4"/6" models. Gutter is a 6"/8". Lure is potentially longer, but it's got some restrictions of its own, and comes on very fragile players.

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4 hours ago, Cole said:

And gained Butchery, and out of activation passes. ;) 

The pass is nice butchery is pretty bad but at least it's something 

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I think this is a good balance and fitting to the newer "theme" as I see Union.

 

She's no longer the headliner damage dealer apart from Rage, but she's still a damn good footballer. Fast and decent kick with enough power to really play the Central Midfielder role.

As for the theme change, I'm seeing a lot of decent brawlers that can still play ball. Union are no longer the beat em up team with one scoring threat. BH, Harry, A&G, Gutter, Mist, and Coin is going to be a solid 2-2 team.

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Good change overall. I play gutter a LOT, and I'm glad she got nerfed from the damage and threat range department. She was in EVERY team that could bring her, and for union, both captains I don't even think about NOT bringing her. I like the new chain grab, used as a controlling tool rather than threat extension, and otherwise she's roughly the same damage wise. 

This is definitely a well done nerf! 

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20 hours ago, kryzak said:

Good change overall. I play gutter a LOT, and I'm glad she got nerfed from the damage and threat range department. She was in EVERY team that could bring her, and for union, both captains I don't even think about NOT bringing her. I like the new chain grab, used as a controlling tool rather than threat extension, and otherwise she's roughly the same damage wise. 

This is definitely a well done nerf! 

 

Meh change. I'd be ok with it if chain grab, like others have pointed out, was able to be used with influence. I would also be ok with the Gutter nerfs if the rest of the team had other models updated to become better brawlers. However, I'm disappointed to find that Union seems overall to be turned into a more football playing team. 

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Total noob here but Gutter seems to be a decent brawler albeit a somewhat situational one.  In my last game (vs Hunters) she managed to get tucked in with five hunters in her melee range and four influence on her.  After 3 scything blows ( I flubbed a roll) hitting 5 models handing out a collective 45 damage, I was a happy camper and didn't even mind her getting pasted.

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18 hours ago, Mudge Black said:

Total noob here but Gutter seems to be a decent brawler albeit a somewhat situational one.  In my last game (vs Hunters) she managed to get tucked in with five hunters in her melee range and four influence on her.  After 3 scything blows ( I flubbed a roll) hitting 5 models handing out a collective 45 damage, I was a happy camper and didn't even mind her getting pasted.

This needs more info, even if attacking the bear, did your opponent put everyone just outside their own melee ranges?

Gutter has fallen from grace and this crazy spike defining example isn't helping lol

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The previous turn there was a dust up between most of the hunters and Gutter with Rage alongside (Thank you Maverick).  They were more focused on trying to take out Rage.  I don't remember the exact order of things but sometime the turn before Gutter charged in, attacked the bear (I think), then chain grabbed Minx and drug her into the mix.  My opponent had some bad dice allowing both to survive to the next turn where Gutter did her thing then got taken out.  I know the whole set up, pull it off was a fluke but it was a GLORIOUS fluke.  BTW even with the damage dealt out, only one model went down (the mascot) but everyone else was more or less sad pandas.  I think Rage took out Egret just before heading to the sidelines himself.  The multiple successes with Gutter were due to targeting the bear's 2+ to get up the playbook.

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Gutter can still get her Scything blow off reliably, but it takes more set-up now. typically it will take 1 or 2 activations prior to Gutter activating. Here's a quick breakdown.

Gutter needs 5 successes for Knockdown. Targeting the "average" 4/1 she wants 9 dice to roll to hit 5 successes. Gutter brings 5 to the fight so the quickest way to add 4 more is to engage with Avarisse, drop Greede for the second engagement, then punch the target for singled out. 2 gang-up plus 2 for "singled out" puts Gutter at 9 dice when she engages.

Secondarily we can look at Minx in team. Minx on a damaging hit applied snared to the target. This drops the "Average" defense to 3/1. Gutter now only needs 7 dice to hit the reliable 5 successes. The trouble here is she needs Minx to continue engaging plus another dice somewhere, possibly from bonus time.

Both of these require a single model to engage beforehand. In a situation where they both engage the target before hand Gutter becomes much more reliable. The goal here would be to bring Avarisse and Greede in first, hitting for singled out and possibly a knock-down. (-1 def / +2 dice, 1 momentum). Minx charges in, now aiming for a 3/1 with 13 dice, which should net 7 successes for both screaming banshee and another result. Now the target is going to be -3 def / +2 dice to give Gutter 11 dice per attack. 11 dice vs a 2/0 should be an average of 9 successes, reliably pulling another target into the fray and delivering scything blow. If rage goes after this it can become a nightmare.

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