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daner0023

Chain Grab & Blind Nerfed?

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7 minutes ago, DreadPirateRoberts said:

Twitter says "New Errata will arrive next week, but all downloadable cards are the current, legal versions".  This is confusing, but maybe we should wait until after the errata comes next week to print off the "final" cards?

Yeah, since we haven't seen an official announcement yet, I would save your time/ink/paper and wait til next week.

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Just now, Woodrow said:

Yeah, since we haven't seen an official announcement yet, I would save your time/ink/paper and wait til next week.

I agree, but for any events this weekend, these card releases take precedent.

?On another note, I am happy with these changes/clarifications.?

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47 minutes ago, daner0023 said:

 

Which is why Stoker having Momentous >> on 1 is awesome.

Whereas, Tower has Momentous > and Knockback on 1, but this combo doesn't work as a Defensive ability.

Completely agree. My point was simply to say that the ability isn't completely useless as you can still utilize it. 

It was ruled in order to make this the case, it just needed pointing out so that people weren't getting the wrong opinion of the ability.

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1 hour ago, DreadPirateRoberts said:

I wonder why Blind is still only usable once per turn?  Is it so unbalanced to spend 4 influence to blind an average of 2 or 3 opposing players?

Maybe it's more about getting to try several times on targets with a high DEF, or it being a cheap Clone/GlutMass counterpossibility? 

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I really can't imagine that they would go to the trouble of making these cards and releasing them if there are more changes planned just next week. I'm going to assume that's all the planned changes.

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Bah wish I would have known these were coming when I went to Kinkos last week and printed my full set of the cards. Oh well, as long as there aren't too many changes I can live with it.

In general what do veteran players think about the card redesign? Personally, I kind of liked the S1 layout and I worry with the S2 layout that I will forget about important character traits (I forgot about them anyway when they were on the front of the card - who am I kidding?).

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Just to clarify, the cards available for download now are the final, updated S2 cards. The 'errata' next week will just formalise the changes to Blind and Chain Grab, while removing errata points which are now redundant since they're on the new cards.

It was just easier to put up the new cards today with the new website going up, rather than wait until next week. :)

 

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22 minutes ago, Biff'd said:

Bah wish I would have known these were coming when I went to Kinkos last week and printed my full set of the cards. Oh well, as long as there aren't too many changes I can live with it.

In general what do veteran players think about the card redesign? Personally, I kind of liked the S1 layout and I worry with the S2 layout that I will forget about important character traits (I forgot about them anyway when they were on the front of the card - who am I kidding?).

You're always going to lose something to the back of the card, but I'd rather it be something I can memorize than be forced to constantly flip back and forth to play the game.

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22 minutes ago, TheLieutenant said:

Just to clarify, the cards available for download now are the final, updated S2 cards. The 'errata' next week will just formalise the changes to Blind and Chain Grab, while removing errata points which are now redundant since they're on the new cards.

It was just easier to put up the new cards today with the new website going up, rather than wait until next week. :)

 

I take it that means there is no intent to fix/remove the redundant playbook results on models like Blackheart and Jac in the near future then?

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I think the new design is great! I usually have my traits memorized (or approximately anyway, still gotta check every so often) after a few games with a player, but having the playbooks always right in front of me really helps me remember unusual possibilities. Graves is a great tackler, for instance. Rage can knockdown on a wrapped charge to avoid counter attacks! Important small stuff like that are harder to remember if you don't flip the card UNTIL you attack.

 

What i don't like, though, is that the season 2 players appear to be colored differently from the revamped season 1 cards. Bonesaw's card is basically all black, whereas the updated season 1 players are still the tannish pallet. Maybe i'll get more used to it as the other S2 playears become available, but right now I don't like the look. Would prefer the whole guild match!

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Was pointed out on Facebook that Hemlocke's Noxious Blast has a mistake in it, saying the suffer Poison if they Start their activation in the AOE rather than end. 

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1 hour ago, TheLieutenant said:

Just to clarify, the cards available for download now are the final, updated S2 cards. The 'errata' next week will just formalise the changes to Blind and Chain Grab, while removing errata points which are now redundant since they're on the new cards.

It was just easier to put up the new cards today with the new website going up, rather than wait until next week. :)

 

In a recent WCWW podcast it was implied/hinted at that a broader rebalancing might be in progress.  Is there still plan to update / tweak some of the underused characters or did I misunderstand?  The season 2 reprint seemed like an opportune time to roll out these changes.  If a rebalancing is in the pipeline, is there a timeframe for when to expect it?

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Tapper's Marked Target is still once per turn.

Hemlocke's Noxious Blast should still be "enters or ends it's activation".

I'm not quite sure how this has happened, I checked the older versions of the files from proof reading, and both abilities are listed correctly there. There may have been a transcription error, or, uh...well, honestly I don't know.

I will update as soon as I find out what's happened. :)

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1 hour ago, DreadPirateRoberts said:

In a recent WCWW podcast it was implied/hinted at that a broader rebalancing might be in progress.  Is there still plan to update / tweak some of the underused characters or did I misunderstand?  The season 2 reprint seemed like an opportune time to roll out these changes.  If a rebalancing is in the pipeline, is there a timeframe for when to expect it?

I hope that what Jamie P mentioned is correct, because certain players need some love to see table time.

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There were discussions around rebalancing certain players, but the decision was ultimately made to leave it for the moment.

One thing we really, really wanted to be careful about was introducing more and more changes into Guild Ball. While there are less used players, it's important to keep the consistency of the game. We're not afraid to make errata, but it's an issue, particularly for newer players, if the game keeps dramatically changing every few months. Or even if we'd made a series of changes now and then said "This is it for the foreseeable future", there will always be that sense that the game is constantly in flux, even if it isn't true. Perception can be as important in these things as actual changes.

The changes to Chain Grab and Blind were felt to be essential to maintaining the healthy balance of the game, but beyond that, we felt it was better to leave the game in place and let the meta develop for the time being.

I understand people's wish for changes to bring up less well used players, but it's a delicate balancing act. I'm sure if we'd made all of the changes we'd considered, we'd be seeing people griping about the game changing too much in too short a time.

Ultimately, everyone at Steamforged loves Guild Ball, and we want to do what's best for the game, business decisions aside. It's been a long time since I've had as much flat out fun as I have playing a miniatures game as I have with GB. We had a lot of discussions about this, and the general feeling was to let it lie for just now. We've seen other miniatures games which have made the mistake of making drastic, sweeping changes early in their lives and faltered because of it. We really don't want that to happen, so while it wasn't an easy decision, we'd rather be safe than sorry.

I hope that clarifies. No other changes to lesser used players at the moment, but it may well be on the table for another day.

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Nae worries. :) There'll be a video from Rich and Jamie going up next week explaining the errata in full, it was just (as far as I understand) easier to put the new cards up now with the new website. Couple teething issues, as with any new website, but we'll be shiny soon.

It's something I was never a fan of with some other miniature companies, the close mouthedness and secrecy. I feel like if you're gonna make changes, yes, people are gonna complain cause that's human nature, that's why you should explain the rationale behind your reasoning. The thing that's gonna annoy most people is the lack of information, rather than anything else. We're just a bunch of dudes who like playing with toys, tbh, any big secrets are fun things coming in future we don't want to spoil the surprise for. :P

(Also, I love your handle. ;) )

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2 hours ago, Doppelbock said:

As far as lesser used models I always figured that people either haven't really figured out the model or maybe there is something coming in the future to make them click.

If there's anything that Gutter and Hemlocke have taught us, it's that the designers and playtesters don't always get it right the first time. If those two ended up so overpowered that they've been corrected downwards twice, there are bound to be a few that ended up underpowered but just haven't been brought up to par.

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