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Stone.and.Mortar

Vassal Bug/Suggestion Thread

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Hello all!

 

So as we get closer to the release of the module I thought it wise to go ahead and reserve a reporting space.

 

If you happen to find any bugs or objects behaving in a way that you feel is unintended then please take a note of it and post that here so that I can attempt to get it fixed. Additionally if you have any suggestions about the way the module runs or particular objects within the module, leave those as well.

 

It would help me quite a bit if you could follow a (loose) format when you post these so that I can navigate them more easily. Something along the lines of :

 

Bug Report

 

Body of Post

(For Bugs)

 

Suggestion

 

Body of Post

(For suggestions)

 

Though really anything that is easily distinguishable will work just fine.

 

Thank you all in advance for helping to make the module better!

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A quickie on first look, the measuring tapes are out by a factor of 10 (the pitch is 360 wide for example).

Edit-Just saw the tooltip,

 

Also the player roster windows seem to have an extra Scrollable List, Im guessing its for some future purpose (to have multiple counters to differential playing the same team on both sides?) but you could rework it to "team panel(Panel)-player list (Scrollable List) - then multiple player single pieces" and it'd get rid of the middle scroll list which doesnt do much.

 

Looks cool so far and looking forward to trying it out on a proper game.

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Yeah the extra list was just a bit of future proofing, the goal is to eventually have player cards listed there as well. I think I would also like to put character specific tokens there, IE a Quick Time token under Honour's listing. This isn't really a requirement, but I think it would speed up the setup process, and that's always a plus in my book.

 

Depending on how things turn out though that is something I will look into. If the guys don't want me to put stat cards in than it is probably just wasted space.

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Hey guys,

 

Firstly a massive thankyou to everyone who has worked on this module. Bathoz and I had our first game on it last night and aside from the learning curve known as the first turn (thanks Gary for helping us get started) it was nice and smooth. It looks great and we kept finding new features as we played, although I'm sure there are plenty that we didn't get to. You have obviously put a lot of time and effort into this.

 

I don't know much (anything) about the vassal engine, so I really don't have any idea of what is possible and what isn't, but I have a few suggestions, comments and questions that came up during the game (and a couple of small bugs). I know that it's a long list but for the most part these are icing suggestions. It is already very usable and relatively intuitive once you understand how to interact with it.

 

Questions:

  • Auras - Do they start at the center of the model or at the edge of the base? We were playing from the edge of the base but I think we got that wrong. It'll make quite a big difference since we were using auras for everything, including movement. (The aura system is great by the way)

 

Suggestions:

  • Game board on right of pitch - Is it possible to put this into a separate window? I was often zoomed in over the action and needed to zoom back out to roll dice and assign momentum. There also seems to be a weird effect where you can't scroll onto that board when you zoom in so the only way of accessing it is zooming out.
  • Hit points - Can you make these a little bigger? I had to zoom right in before I could read them.
  • Scatter template - is it possible to give an option to automatically line it up with the goals? It would just make the scatters a little quicker, especially with the server lag while rotating.
  • Player direction arrows - Is it possible to make it visible to both players, not just the one controlling it? We wanted to confirm the direction for directly away before moving.
  • Player movement - It would be nice to see a projection of the player movement at the width of the base so that you can check engagement zones more and base clashes more easily. It would also be great if you could plot a path and then execute the move rather than cloning the model while you work out the route.
  • Undo - Would it be possible to add the normal keyboard shortcut for undo?
  • Player Bases - Is it possible to lock the players down so that you can't place two on top of each other?
  • Auras - We (I) were sometimes a little lazy in clearing auras and would have to go through player by player removing them when they got a bit much. Is it possible to add a "clear all auras" button?
  • Influence - Would it be possible to add an "Allocated Influence" field for each team so that you know how much has been assigned.
  • Player list - Would it be possible to add a player list for each team? I'm thinking of a simple table with players name, current hp, influence and conditions

 

Comments:

  • Measuring Tape - Takes a little getting used to but works fine once you've got the hang of it. The trick is that once you are finished measuring you need to click off the tape to leave the measurement there and allow you to clear it with the button.

 

Bugs:

  • Player card doesn't appear when you select View Player Card from the Core menu
  • When hovering over a player the title for the expanded view is always "GameMat" rather than the players name

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Yeti, on 31 Mar 2015 - 07:44 AM, said:

 

Hey guys,

 

Firstly a massive thankyou to everyone who has worked on this module. Bathoz and I had our first game on it last night and aside from the learning curve known as the first turn (thanks Gary for helping us get started) it was nice and smooth. It looks great and we kept finding new features as we played, although I'm sure there are plenty that we didn't get to. You have obviously put a lot of time and effort into this.

 

I don't know much (anything) about the vassal engine, so I really don't have any idea of what is possible and what isn't, but I have a few suggestions, comments and questions that came up during the game (and a couple of small bugs). I know that it's a long list but for the most part these are icing suggestions. It is already very usable and relatively intuitive once you understand how to interact with it.

Vassal doesn't really have a programming language, if you want to do any automation you more or less have to create your own Turing engine using items in the object. The problem with this is it's very memory intensive as unlike most programming the memory usage goes up exponentially for the number of items in an object. So the trick is to choose when you need automation and when to let the players do it. Also with noreal programming a lot of things are impossible or if possible would need silly amounts of work and would probably kill the module performance.

 

Questions:

Auras - Do they start at the center of the model or at the edge of the base? We were playing from the edge of the base but I think we got that wrong. It'll make quite a big difference since we were using auras for everything, including movement. (The aura system is great by the way)

 

 

They start at the edge of the base.

 

Suggestions:

Game board on right of pitch - Is it possible to put this into a separate window? I was often zoomed in over the action and needed to zoom back out to roll dice and assign momentum. There also seems to be a weird effect where you can't scroll onto that board when you zoom in so the only way of accessing it is zooming out.

 

Remember there are key strokes for roll a number of dice, which gives the results in the message window, and also keystrokes for increasing momentum (I might add a message when you increase or decrease momentum in the text window).

 

 

Hit points - Can you make these a little bigger? I had to zoom right in before I could read them.

 

It is possible, I did find the covered up the model if they went much bigger, but I'll have another look.

 

 

Scatter template - is it possible to give an option to automatically line it up with the goals? It would just make the scatters a little quicker, especially with the server lag while rotating.

 

 

Try using the Free Rotate [End], that doesn't seem to lag as badly, but no there is no way Vassal could line it up automatically.

 

 

Player direction arrows - Is it possible to make it visible to both players, not just the one controlling it? We wanted to confirm the direction for directly away before moving.

 

Not without it being visable all the time which would make it impossible to see the image of the model, if your worried about directly away use the LOS tool next to the tape measure and start at the center of the model your piece is moving away from.

 

Player movement - It would be nice to see a projection of the player movement at the width of the base so that you can check engagement zones more and base clashes more easily. It would also be great if you could plot a path and then execute the move rather than cloning the model while you work out the route.

 

Not possible with Vassal.

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Undo - Would it be possible to add the normal keyboard shortcut for undo?

 

That should be perfectly doable I believe

 

Player Bases - Is it possible to lock the players down so that you can't place two on top of each other?

 

Not easily in Vassal and the performance loss would not be worth it.

 

Auras - We (I) were sometimes a little lazy in clearing auras and would have to go through player by player removing them when they got a bit much. Is it possible to add a "clear all auras" button?

 

This is something I'm looking into, it would add a lot of extra items to the player tokens and I'm not sure if it would have a bad knock on effect to the speed of the module or not as I might be able to drop them in at the end of the players list. I will have a play.

 

Influence - Would it be possible to add an "Allocated Influence" field for each team so that you know how much has been assigned.

Player list - Would it be possible to add a player list for each team? I'm thinking of a simple table with players name, current hp, influence and conditions

 

In the last version before the final rules it had an Allocated Influence field, but it was slowing down the module hugely so it was removed for speed.

 

Comments:

Measuring Tape - Takes a little getting used to but works fine once you've got the hang of it. The trick is that once you are finished measuring you need to click off the tape to leave the measurement there and allow you to clear it with the button.

 

Bugs:

Player card doesn't appear when you select View Player Card from the Core menu

 

You need to open your Statistics Window with the button at the top of the screen

 

When hovering over a player the title for the expanded view is always "GameMat" rather than the players name

 

I'm not seeing that at all. What are you running it on?

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Thanks for the response Ratty. I understand your automation vs speed problem. Out of interest, where does the game actually run? Is it peer to peer or server side?

 

I'm running the game on a MacBook Pro from a couple of years ago.

 

Edit: Of course now that I try to go into the game and get you a screenshot it's not doing it...

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Hey Ratty,

Just one more request from me. Can you add an alternative to the end key? Two reasons for this, firstly a lot of laptop keyboards don't have one (although it's fn -> on my mac), secondly, whenever it is pressed the pitch scrolls to the bottom.

 

Cheers,

Yeti

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For really tight situations, try the following:

1) Select enemy model(s) you wish to avoid being engaged by and put up their Melee zone (check control file for shortcut - Z or Q off the top of my head)

2) Put up an aura on the moving friendly model for the first part of move

3) Leave moving model in place and clone. Place clone completely within aura range

4) On cloned model, put up aura for second part of move

5) Repeat 3 & 4 till move is completed, each time checking not being engaged

6) Instead of using auras, manually rotate left / right (+ SHIFT for fine tune) and move forwards (+ SHIFT for 0.5" move)

7) Clear melee zones

8) Clear all non-final copies of moving model

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Hey Ratty, so found. Another little oddity that I think should be an easy fix. Everytime a number is entered in chat it rolls dice, this makes chatting a little frustrating. Maybe just another keystroke thrown on?

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lol, yeah it is a minor issue.. but the problem is the number of different controls on numbers.. I would have to look and see what is free. I do find just the number key for the first 10 is cool though, it's fast to access.. also, who uses chat :P

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As discussed Ratty:

1) Add "DEL" as an alternative to "CTRL + X"

2) A path in the direction of the forward travel of a model, at width equal to the base, similar to the ball trail (just the other direction)

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As discussed Ratty:

1) Add "DEL" as an alternative to "CTRL + X"

2) A path in the direction of the forward travel of a model, at width equal to the base, similar to the ball trail (just the other direction)

 

Turns out you can't assign Del to a command.

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So I just noticed that the demo game has different character cards to the main game... very glad I figured that out before I posted a bug.  :P

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Hey Ratty,

I've got a couple of small points following my game this evening.

1) The templates sit above the models, which can make it quite difficult to get to the models underneath them, particularly if the template is centered on the model (e.g. smoke cloud). I don't know what to suggest to prevent this... possibly put the template below the models (although then how do you access the template?).

2) We made a couple of mistakes where we were working with the wrong size aura. e.g. Pull up Vitriol's 9" aura for the sprint then accidentally use the same aura for shooting. They were entirely our fault but I was wondering if there was anyway of identifying the size of the aura on the pitch, perhaps adding text to the aura stating it's size.

 

On a different note, I really like the recent changes that you've made, particularly the addition of the movement path to models and the modification of the HP text, they make life a lot easier.

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Yeti the AoEs now have a handle which is the only bit that actually can be picked up. You can grab models below an AoE by clicking anywhere else. and as the handle is able half the size of even a 30mm model it should never be impossible to select a model.

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