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Hillfood

Oooh... BALL! During Hunters vs Hunters

When a ball marker becomes a Free Ball and is placed within 6" of two opposing Snow models, which model triggers first?

 

If I had to make a ruling on the spot I'd say the Snow model belonging to the player who is currently activating triggers first, but I have the luxury of time right now so I can ask for a more official answer. 

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I can't think of a precedent for two effects controlled by different players being triggered at the same time.  Presumably it's resolved the same was as if Sakana ends an advance that started in both Tentacles and Dirge's melee zones, triggering both Tag Along and Follow Up.  Whichever mascot moves first is probably the same as in the double Snow case, although I wouldn't know which it would be.

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If either Snow was currently activating I'd say this was an easy call, but say one of the players' Chaska is activating. He declares a Pass to Egret, fails, and after the scatter nobody is positioned in a way to be able to either Intercept or Snap the ball, and it becomes a Free Ball within 6" of both Snows. Each Snow has a different Controlling Player, and nobody currently controls the Ball Marker. Is the Controlling Player considered to be the person whose activation it currently is, regardless of which model is activating?

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In my understanding it's not that important in which order you resolve simultaneous effects (considering both Snows can reach the ball - parting blows, terrain & ground, models in the way, etc.). What is really interesting is what happens next? 

Rules mention a snap to when 1 model moves within 1" of a free ball, or a "d6 + kick stat" roll in case if there is more than 1 model within 1" of the ball-marker... but only when it's placed. There's nothing about what happens when 2 models simultaneously move within 1" of the ball.

It would be logical to apply the same mechanics here and use the roll to determine which model will gain possession of the ball, but it's not written so anywhere. 

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You can check out the definition of controling player on pg 13 of the s3 rulebook, basically the controlling player is the one who's activation it is (or who's placing a goal kick) unless the opposing player is performing an action, at which point she becomes the opposing player.

So in the case of double Ooh... Ball! the controling player is the one placing the scatter. Once the scatter is placed, both players declare Ooh... Ball! and since the player placing the scatter is still the controlling player at that point, they get to decide which model uses the ability first.

Both models definitely don't move simultaneously.

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As a bit of a follow-up point, assuming both players declare Ooh... Ball! and Snow1 jogs and then snaps the ball, Snow2 would no longer be able to make her jog, as there is no longer free-ball token to move directly towards. This would however use up the once per turn ability for the turn.

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What if Sakana moves out of Tentacle's melee zone into a spot within 6" of both Brink and Marbles who are within Go Ape range?  If the Masons player declares that both Counter Charge but the Fisherman declares that Tentacles Tags Along, does he get to declare the order in which the counter charges are resolved or just if Tentacles will be the first or last to move?

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I think he gets to move Tentacles after the charges have been resolved. But as he has said Tentacles is moving he can't change his mind unless Sakana is Taken out. (There would be no-one to tag along with)

Bill

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31 minutes ago, MechMage said:

What if Sakana moves out of Tentacle's melee zone into a spot within 6" of both Brink and Marbles who are within Go Ape range?  If the Masons player declares that both Counter Charge but the Fisherman declares that Tentacles Tags Along, does he get to declare the order in which the counter charges are resolved or just if Tentacles will be the first or last to move?

Fair point.

I'd say that she remains the controlling player until Brick or Marbles actually make their charges, at which point it switches, she can therefore decide to move Tentacles before or after the counter charge(s).

Once she allows her opponent to make a counter charge, the two charges are still happening simultaneously and the opponent is now the controlling player and can choose the order or charge.

Once one charge is resolved, control flips back to the first player (there's a split second where no action is being performed by either of player two's counter charging models, therefore control defaults to the player who's activation it is), who can then decide to move Tentacles if she's not done so already, or to force the second counter charge.

I think this way of doing it sticks to the definitions on page 13, tho' I'm sure it could be open to argument as it's reasonably unclear at certain points.

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